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Traveller-digest     Monday, November 29 1999     Volume 1999 : Number 1411<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.<BR>
All rights reserved.<BR>
<BR>
The following topics are covered in this digest:<BR>
<BR>
Re: Traveller-like fiction<BR>
Re:  Rule of Man coin<BR>
Re: Rule of man coin<BR>
Latin pronounciation (was Re: Rule of man coin)<BR>
Re: Police ranks<BR>
Re: How Low can You Go?<BR>
Re: Rule of Man Coin<BR>
Re: Rule of man coin<BR>
Re: Rule of man coin<BR>
Re: Eris' Computers<BR>
Re: Youth Generation for CT<BR>
Re: Loans and Indentures<BR>
re: Skip Tracing<BR>
Re: Skipping<BR>
RE: Eris' Computers<BR>
Excel Spreadsheet for High Guard<BR>
Re: Eris' Computers<BR>
Re: Eris' Computers<BR>
Re: early christian writings and roman rumors<BR>
RE: Traveller-like fiction<BR>
re: early christian writings and roman rumors<BR>
Traveller Adventure: The Acadian<BR>
<BR>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:18:37 +1300<BR>
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-like fiction<BR>
<BR>
On 29 Nov 99, at 1:22, Charles R Hensley wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Whoever mentioned E.C.Tubb's Dumarest Saga want to give the names of<BR>
> these books.  I started looking for them and found Symbol of Terra,<BR>
> Dumarest of Terra #30 which only lists 19 books in the series.  How many<BR>
> are there and what is the order they are to be read in????<BR>
<BR>
Here's a list of the one's I've got or know about, in order:<BR>
<BR>
1.	The Winds of Gath<BR>
2.	Derai<BR>
3.	Toyman<BR>
4.	Kalin<BR>
5.	The Jester at Scar<BR>
6.	Lallia<BR>
7.	Technos<BR>
8.	Veruchia<BR>
9.	Mayenne<BR>
10.	Jondelle<BR>
11.	Zenya<BR>
12.	Eloise<BR>
13.	The Eye of the Zodiac (I don't have this, and my copy of _Jack of <BR>
Swords lists it as number 12, and _Eloise_ as 13, however my copy of <BR>
_Eloise_ claims to be number 12, and claims to be the original <BR>
paperback edition).<BR>
14.	Jack of Swords<BR>
15.	Spectrum of a Forgotten Sun<BR>
16.	Haven of Darkness (Two copies)<BR>
17.	Prison of Night (I don't have this)<BR>
18.	Incident on Ath (Don't have this, either)<BR>
19.	The Quillian Sector<BR>
20.	Web of Sand (Don't have it)<BR>
21.	Iduna's Universe<BR>
22.	The Terra Data<BR>
23.	World of Promise<BR>
24.	?? (Don't have it, don't know its name)<BR>
25.	The Terridae<BR>
<BR>
That's all I have, and I haven't seen any around lately, more's the <BR>
pity.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Rupert Boleyn <paradise.net.nz><BR>
Wellington, New Zealand<BR>
<BR>
A pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:18:37 +1300<BR>
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
Subject: Re:  Rule of Man coin<BR>
<BR>
On 28 Nov 99, at 17:48, Richard K. Persky wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> >From: "Luther Martin" <tml@ksarul.com><BR>
> >Subject: Re: Re:Rule of Man Coin<BR>
> <BR>
> >Next, the "amplois" may be from amplio, -are, "to make wide, increase,"<BR>
> >but the form seems wrong again. I would expect something like "ampliat."<BR>
> >I think that the intended meaning falls along these lines.<BR>
> <BR>
>      Hm.  What I'd really like to do with it is read "amplois ouam <BR>
> gloriam astribus" as "amplius quam gloria astrorum," which would make the<BR>
> whole thing translate to "The Rule of Man shines more brilliantly than the<BR>
> glory of the stars."  Unfortunately, while I can imagine "amplius quam"<BR>
> being misread as "amplois ouam," the last two words are beyond my ability<BR>
> to rationalize. <shrug> Perhaps the only book on Latin grammar to survive<BR>
> until the Rule of Man had some errors in it?<BR>
<BR>
Is it possible that it's Church Latin, rather than classical? IIRC <BR>
Church Latin has some weird differences from Classical.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Rupert Boleyn <paradise.net.nz><BR>
Wellington, New Zealand<BR>
<BR>
A pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:18:37 +1300<BR>
From: "Rupert Boleyn" <rboleyn@paradise.net.nz><BR>
Subject: Re: Rule of man coin<BR>
<BR>
On 28 Nov 99, at 22:59, Chris Seamans wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Nah, I doubt the language is going to change... pronunciation might<BR>
> though. I took three years of Latin and learned one set of rules for<BR>
> pronunciation, but it seems that the rest of the world learned an entirely<BR>
> different set of rules for pronunciation.<BR>
> <BR>
> That can be somewhat disorienting.<BR>
<BR>
So, did you get taught "v" as "v", "v" as "w" or "v" as a sort of mix? <BR>
At school we got told that the "v" should be slightly soft, at <BR>
university that a fairly hard "v" was OK as there are no Romans left to <BR>
hear, but one of our lecturers used some horrid mixture of a soft "v" <BR>
and a "w".<BR>
<BR>
That and that agricola means farmer is about all I can remember, though.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Rupert Boleyn <paradise.net.nz><BR>
Wellington, New Zealand<BR>
<BR>
A pessimist is an optimist with a sense of history.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 04:11:34 -0800<BR>
From: "Glenn M. Goffin" <gmgoffin@pacbell.net><BR>
Subject: Latin pronounciation (was Re: Rule of man coin)<BR>
<BR>
> From: "Chris Seamans" <semo@pil.net><BR>
> Subject: Re: Rule of man coin<BR>
<BR>
> Nah, I doubt the language is going to change... pronunciation might though.<BR>
> I took three years of Latin and learned one set of rules for pronunciation,<BR>
> but it seems that the rest of the world learned an entirely different set<BR>
> of rules for pronunciation.<BR>
> <BR>
> That can be somewhat disorienting.<BR>
<BR>
Latin was a living language for a long time, so it's not surprising that<BR>
there are different ways to pronounce it.  My imperfect understanding is<BR>
as follows:  Classical Latin was spoken a very long time ago, like<BR>
before 0 CE.  Vulgar Latin and Church Latin are the more recent use, and<BR>
are pronounced somewhat like Italian.  Legal Latin differs from country<BR>
to country, and only vaguely resembles Classical or Vulgar Latin (that<BR>
is certainly the case in English).  Italian is known to some people as<BR>
Latin for regular people to use.<BR>
<BR>
- --Glenn<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 13:00:06 +0100 (MET)<BR>
From: Tommy Grav <tommy.grav@astro.uio.no><BR>
Subject: Re: Police ranks<BR>
<BR>
On Sun, 28 Nov 1999, Jeff Zeitlin wrote:<BR>
<BR>
>That's actually an adapted list; the complete list would be as<BR>
>follows:<BR>
><BR>
>Recruit<BR>
>Police Officer/Detective<BR>
>Corporal/Detective Investigator<BR>
>Sergeant/Detective Sergeant<BR>
>Lieutenant<BR>
>Commander<BR>
>Captain<BR>
>Deputy Inspector<BR>
>Inspector<BR>
>Assistant Chief<BR>
>Vice Chief<BR>
>Bureau Chief<BR>
>Chief of Department<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
So where does the rural sheriff and his deputy fit in ?<BR>
<BR>
>--<BR>
>Jeff Zeitlin<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Tommy Grav<BR>
- -------------------------------------------------------------<BR>
tommy.grav@astro.uio.no     http://www.uio.no/~tommygr/  <BR>
Institute of Astrophysics, UiO, No  <BR>
IMTU tn++t4+tg+ ru+ge++ !3i jt+au+st+ls hi++dr-so++zh-sy-sw++ <BR>
 <BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 07:21:55 -0600<BR>
From: "Robert Eaglestone" <eaglesto@nortelnetworks.com><BR>
Subject: Re: How Low can You Go?<BR>
<BR>
Providing a minimal sensor package that requires constant<BR>
human attention might be a great money saving idea.  It also<BR>
boosts the importance of having "sensors" skill and requires<BR>
another full crewmember.<BR>
<BR>
It might also be a stressful job.<BR>
<BR>
"Captain!  We've entered the system, but there's nothing there!<BR>
Some huge, ancient war machine must have gobbled up all the<BR>
planets!"<BR>
<BR>
"Mr. Dvechok, please remove Mr. Sulu from the sensor post.<BR>
He's been snorting that blue powder from Condaria again."<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 09:25:22 -0500<BR>
From: Ethan Henry <egh@klg.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Rule of Man Coin<BR>
<BR>
GDWGAMES@aol.com wrote:	<BR>
> <BR>
> >  "DOMINATUS HOMINIS SPLENDET SPLENDIDE AMPLOIS OUAM GLORIAM ASTRIBUS"<BR>
> <BR>
> I always translated it along the lines of "The splendor of the Rule of Man<BR>
> outshines the glory of the stars." but Bill Keith came up with it.<BR>
<BR>
Gee, too bad it doesn't translate to something like:<BR>
<BR>
"The splendor of the Rule of Man outshines the Empire of the Stars"<BR>
<BR>
I would expect the Solomani (nee Terrans) to gloat at least a little bit.<BR>
<BR>
- --<BR>
Ethan Henry                                        egh@klg.com<BR>
Java Evangelist, KL Group                   http://www.klg.com<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 10:01:42 -0500 (EST)<BR>
From: Kenji Schwarz <schwarz@fas.harvard.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Rule of man coin<BR>
<BR>
On Sun, 28 Nov 1999 GaryBartz@aol.com wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Actually, Latin is in the process of being changed now on the altar of <BR>
> PCness. At my undergrad school they tried to change from alumnus/alumna to <BR>
> "Alums", but were shouted down by the cries of everyone who figured that <BR>
> would make the university look illiterate. Now I am at a top 25 school, where <BR>
> they want to look stupid, if it gets them one more minority awareness point. <BR>
> I am sure Latin will continue to change over time, for these type and for <BR>
> godd reasons.<BR>
<BR>
Actually, Gary, this isn't changing it on the altar of PCness, it's<BR>
changing it on the altar of grammaticality.  Referring to female graduates<BR>
with a male-gendered pronoun was ungrammatical in classical, vulgar, and<BR>
(so far as I've been told) medieval latin.  Cicero and Sallust, if they<BR>
were alive and kicking today, would be major PC-ifiers, by this standard<BR>
:)<BR>
<BR>
Kenji<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 10:10:09 -0500 (EST)<BR>
From: Kenji Schwarz <schwarz@fas.harvard.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Rule of man coin<BR>
<BR>
On Mon, 29 Nov 1999, Kenji Schwarz wrote:<BR>
<BR>
> Actually, Gary, this isn't changing it on the altar of PCness, it's<BR>
> changing it on the altar of grammaticality.  Referring to female graduates<BR>
> with a male-gendered pronoun was ungrammatical in classical, vulgar, and<BR>
                       ^^^^^^^<BR>
<BR>
Adjective in this case, yes, yes, an adjective, I suck, don't tell my<BR>
profs, they already know.<BR>
<BR>
Kenji<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 09:57:07 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Eris' Computers<BR>
<BR>
Zane H. Healy wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
> >On 11/28/99 at 11:11 PM,  "Earl Hampton" <earliii@neta.com> said:<BR>
> ><BR>
<BR>
> Software and databases would have a minimum of two quality levels, civilian<BR>
> and military, and in reality, would probably have more.  For example, there<BR>
> might be a level above military that includes data not normally available<BR>
> to the military (spy ships of some sort might fall into this catagory).<BR>
> <BR>
> Now here is a scarry thought, because all this is computer controlled the<BR>
> Imperium might very well be able to arrange for certain classes of ships to<BR>
> remain undetected simply by having the software not display the tracks!<BR>
> <BR>
> BTW, what was the purpose of your list?<BR>
<BR>
Those would probably fit in as different library modules. Off list, in<BR>
the Akus Moby PBEM game we're having the same discussion, and a question<BR>
I asked was 'what's' the Library...Eris answer was, essentially, that<BR>
they were databases of different types.<BR>
<BR>
So to answer your question, we have to buy 'Janes All the Imperium<BR>
Starships'.<BR>
<BR>
However, if the Imperium started playing games with what is and isn't<BR>
detected, well, then we get into the fun stuff, like collisions between<BR>
civ ships and these undetectable spy ships. Also, these things don't<BR>
control the sensors, just interface with them to provide more info. That<BR>
unknown will show up as an unknown, not as nothing. More likely, though,<BR>
it'll show up as a oohh, fishing trawler or something ;-)<BR>
<BR>
And Eris said:<BR>
<BR>
><BR>
>...and thanks for the kind words, Earl.<BR>
><BR>
>Eris<BR>
<BR>
Good suck-up post, Earl...for that we _are_ going to wake you rudely :-P<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 10:17:30 -0700<BR>
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@pharmacy.arizona.edu><BR>
Subject: Re: Youth Generation for CT<BR>
<BR>
Leonard Erickson wrote:<BR>
> <BR>
<BR>
> For that matter Scouting started out as a "paramilitary" organization<BR>
> modeled after certain aspects of the (British) Army. I dare say that<BR>
> Scouting should continue on into the future. Maybe even wind up as a<BR>
> sort of "cadet" program for the IISS.<BR>
><BR>
<BR>
Cool! I'll get my Carousing and Rank Insubordination merit badges right<BR>
off! ;-)<BR>
<BR>
- -- <BR>
Bruce Johnson<BR>
University of Arizona<BR>
College of Pharmacy<BR>
Information Technology Group<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 09:32:14 -0800 (PST)<BR>
From: Anthony Jackson <ajackson@molly.iii.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Loans and Indentures<BR>
<BR>
Craig Berry writes:<BR>
 <BR>
> Dropping electronics is a question of what you think can be dispensed with<BR>
> safely (or safely enough to satisfy potential passengers, freight agents,<BR>
> starport authorities, and crewmembers).  Dropping volume, though, comes<BR>
> straight off the bottom line; smaller ship equals smaller hold and<BR>
> passenger quarters equals smaller revenue.  It does little good to reduce<BR>
> ship payments by a factor of 10 if you also cut operating revenues by a<BR>
> factor of 10.  In fact, it will hurt; certain fixed costs become more<BR>
> relatively important when the volume is small.<BR>
<BR>
My point is that it becomes more viable for a PC who is not otherwise independently wealthy to own a ship by making smaller ships, not that the ship becomes any more economically practical.<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 12:39:02 -0500<BR>
From: Walter Smith <SmithW@HARTWICK.EDU><BR>
Subject: re: Skip Tracing<BR>
<BR>
Ethan Henry wrote;<BR>
>>>>>>><BR>
I think the problem is that the average sci-fi writer (and Leonard)<BR>
pictures a planet full of criminals who have the amazing breadth<BR>
and depth of knowledge... of a science fiction writer (or Leonard).<BR>
<BR>
I'm not saying criminals are dumb, but they've put most of their<BR>
energy toward developing skills other than ore smelting and <BR>
metallurgy.<BR>
>>>>>>><BR>
Depends on the government putting the people in prison.<BR>
<BR>
Get the right kind of cliche oppressive state, and the nasty citizens will<BR>
be government employees, while the prisons will be well-stocked<BR>
with artists, philosophers and scientists.<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 11:37:56 -0700<BR>
From: Clay <arioch@theriver.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Skipping<BR>
<BR>
>> I would think it would be very easy for a bank to determine which<BR>
branch<BR>
>> a ship will be making its' payment at.  When the loan is first<BR>
applied<BR>
>> for the bank would want an exact business plan & itinerary on how the<BR>
<BR>
>> ship will be used to make a profit.  They would determine that the<BR>
ship<BR>
>> would have to stop off at a specific branch to make payments every so<BR>
<BR>
>> many months.  If the ship didn't show, it would automatically be<BR>
>> reported to the authorities and a repo list.  A bank wouldn't approve<BR>
a<BR>
>> loan on a wide, far reaching, or risky route.<BR>
><BR>
>Sorry, but that's equivalent to requiring an *independent* long haul<BR>
>trucker to file an itinerary months in advance. Just like Free Traders,<BR>
<BR>
>they go where the cargoes are.<BR>
<BR>
IMTU banks don't make loans to traders who want to just "follow the<BR>
market".  It is too risky.  Especially when you factor in elements like<BR>
skipping, piracy, communications lag, misjumps, and so on.  The only<BR>
really independent Free Traders are ones that are old and paid off<BR>
already (by working the small but regular trade routes and freight lines<BR>
for many years).<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 14:05:40 -0500<BR>
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca><BR>
Subject: RE: Eris' Computers<BR>
<BR>
Earl Hampton writes:<BR>
>>>My biggest problem with designing craft with Traveller computers has<BR>
>>>been there doesn't seem to be any scaling effect.  It doesn't  seem<BR>
>>>right that a particular computer will operate the same whether it's<BR>
>>>in a 1000 ton cruiser or a 100 ton scout.  Other than that, I agree<BR>
>>>completely with your assesment of computers in Traveller.<BR>
>>Yeah, I thought about that too.  I think there should be some sort<BR>
>>of size factor, but I'm not sure how to work it in.<BR>
>I've also thought about the computer scaling problem with<BR>
>traveller. The only way I see to get around it, if you go with<BR>
>the programs, is to have to have more programs on larger ships.<BR>
<BR>
	My take has always been that the added computer requirements<BR>
	of larger ships are provided for in subsystems located<BR>
	around the ship, and additional computer systems that are<BR>
	part of the 'bridge' tonnage.  This leaves the Main<BR>
	Computer free to deal with jumps, targeting, etc.<BR>
<BR>
>The combat programs are the easiest to do this with. If every<BR>
>gun or perhaps battery requires another program then we now<BR>
>will need more computer. If you then consider the program feeds<BR>
>a gunnery program must have we end up with even more computer<BR>
>needed.<BR>
<snipped><BR>
<BR>
	IMTU, a fully-equiped turret includes it's own computer,<BR>
	which interfaces with the Main Computer.  Apart from a<BR>
	Multitarget program, a separate Predict program would<BR>
	have to be run for each separate target (but not for each<BR>
	turret).  A fighter without a full 'small bridge' needs<BR>
	to have special Small Craft Maneuver and Small Craft<BR>
	Sensor programs to function (these are functions normally<BR>
	carried out by computer systems integral to the bridge).<BR>
<BR>
Peez<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 14:24:09 -0500<BR>
From: Ian Ferguson <ian@vax2.concordia.ca><BR>
Subject: Excel Spreadsheet for High Guard<BR>
<BR>
This is a recall notice for my Excel Spreadsheet that aids in designing<BR>
High Guard ships.  I have been using it extensively in designing ships for<BR>
an upcoming TCS campaign, and to my great embarassment I have found a<BR>
number of errors (eg. adding armour makes the ship cheeper! all because of<BR>
one little missing '-').  I apologise most sincerely to anyone who has used<BR>
this spreadsheet.  The corrected and revised version is available to anyone<BR>
who is interested, simply contact me off list.<BR>
<BR>
Peez<BR>
ian@vax2.concordia.ca<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 11:29:21 -0800<BR>
From: "Zane H. Healy" <healyzh@aracnet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Eris' Computers<BR>
<BR>
>I don't have much problem with that. IMO the controls (in FF&S, MT,<BR>
>etc), which are volume dependent, represent the parts of the computer<BR>
>system that vary in size with the size of the ship. I see no real need<BR>
>to make the CPU and memory change in size with increasing ship size.<BR>
>However maybe it should cost more (for extra HD space, more expensive<BR>
>software, etc).<BR>
<BR>
One question would be, to what extent is what we consider Hard Drive space<BR>
simply Computer memory at a certain techlevel?  Hard Drives are a thing of<BR>
the past, even for us, to many moving parts so reliability is a problem.<BR>
The future is most likely Holographic storage(1), or some form of RAM disk<BR>
along the lines of what a lot of digital cameras use.  This is current<BR>
tech, though not widely available or even known, who is to say what they're<BR>
using in the Imperium.<BR>
<BR>
In any case the larger the ship the greater the requirements for CPU and<BR>
memory capacity.  Each thing the computer is keeping track of will require<BR>
at least a little memory, and the more things you keep track of the more<BR>
CPU horsepower it will take to track everything.<BR>
<BR>
			Zane<BR>
<BR>
(1) Holographic storage and optical computer have been around for over 10<BR>
years.  Recently some serious advances in Laser technology have seriously<BR>
increased the storage capacity of such things.  IIRC, 10 years ago a piece<BR>
of material the size of a sugar cube could hold the equivalent of a CD-ROM.<BR>
Unfortunatly this tech is still in the laboratory as far as I know.<BR>
| Zane H. Healy                    | UNIX Systems Adminstrator  |<BR>
| healyzh@aracnet.com (primary)    | Linux Enthusiast           |<BR>
| healyzh@holonet.net (alternate)  | Classic Computer Collector |<BR>
+----------------------------------+----------------------------+<BR>
|     Empire of the Petal Throne and Traveller Role Playing,    |<BR>
|                   and Zane's Computer Museum.                 |<BR>
|                 http://www.aracnet.com/~healyzh/              |<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 11:42:08 -0800<BR>
From: "Zane H. Healy" <healyzh@aracnet.com><BR>
Subject: Re: Eris' Computers<BR>
<BR>
>However, if the Imperium started playing games with what is and isn't<BR>
>detected, well, then we get into the fun stuff, like collisions between<BR>
>civ ships and these undetectable spy ships. Also, these things don't<BR>
>control the sensors, just interface with them to provide more info. That<BR>
>unknown will show up as an unknown, not as nothing. More likely, though,<BR>
>it'll show up as a oohh, fishing trawler or something ;-)<BR>
<BR>
Well, presumably the spy ship would simply move out of the way.  If they<BR>
got to close the computer would probably sound a colision alert.  Or<BR>
<bwahahaha> just blow the ship up :^)<BR>
<BR>
As for controlling the sensors, they would to a certain extent, but mainly<BR>
they'd be analyzing and displaying the data.  You want the person setting<BR>
at the computer to be able to turn on/off sensors, or focus them on a<BR>
specific object.  You also want the computer to handle the majority of the<BR>
work.<BR>
<BR>
				Zane<BR>
| Zane H. Healy                    | UNIX Systems Adminstrator  |<BR>
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------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 11:51:47 -0800<BR>
From: "Jason T. Barnabas" <cybernaut@netzero.net><BR>
Subject: Re: early christian writings and roman rumors<BR>
<BR>
Someone wrote:<BR>
 >This is one of the reasons that I can't personally accept Christianity<BR>
 >based on Scripture.  There was a hell of a lot of Scripture that got<BR>
 >thrown out; the Bible Christians have today was heavily edited and revised<BR>
 >by many committees hundreds of years after the death of Jesus and none of<BR>
 >the Gospels were actually written down sooner than 100-200 years after his<BR>
 >death, though they may have been transmitted orally.  And as these were<BR>
 >not primarily oral cultures, I don't particularly trust oral transmission<BR>
 >from the Jews, Greeks and Romans of that era.<BR>
<BR>
I generally try to stay out of this type of thread; however, I<BR>
really must protest.  The New Testement is one of the<BR>
most studied books ever and is the best authenticated<BR>
document in the history of man.  The last portion of the<BR>
New Testement (commonly called the Revelation of St.<BR>
John), was probably written before 70 AD (less than 40<BR>
years after the death of Yeshua (Jesus).<BR>
<BR>
There is a complete manuscript of the New Testement<BR>
that dates back to c. 100 AD.  It contains the same 27<BR>
books that are in the modern "canon."  While it is true<BR>
that there is some dispute over certain "additions/<BR>
deletions" in some of the ancient manuscripts, it is also<BR>
true that none of those disputed passages are the only<BR>
place where the things added/deleted are included.  If all<BR>
of the disputed passages were deleted, nothing would<BR>
change.  If all of them were included, again, nothing<BR>
would change.<BR>
<BR>
By comparison, for the next best authenticated historical<BR>
document, the oldest manuscript was copied over 400<BR>
years after the completion of the document in question.<BR>
<BR>
I'm not saying that you should become a christian;<BR>
however, I am saying that as a historical document,<BR>
there is not a better documented/authenticated one<BR>
extant.<BR>
- --<BR>
Jason<BR>
___________________________________________<BR>
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------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 13:07:16 -0000<BR>
From: "Mark Preston" <mark@mpreston.demon.co.uk><BR>
Subject: RE: Traveller-like fiction<BR>
<BR>
Paul, do you know where I can get the last three, now that they are<BR>
out of print?<BR>
<BR>
- -----Original Message-----<BR>
From: owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
[mailto:owner-traveller@lists.imagiconline.com]On Behalf Of Jerry Paul<BR>
Sanders<BR>
Sent: 29 November 1999 09:49<BR>
To: traveller@lists.imagiconline.com<BR>
Subject: Re: Traveller-like fiction<BR>
<BR>
Symbol of Terra<BR>
The Temple of Truth<BR>
The Return<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 15:58:33 -0500<BR>
From: Walter Smith <SmithW@HARTWICK.EDU><BR>
Subject: re: early christian writings and roman rumors<BR>
<BR>
Jason T. Barnabas wrote:<BR>
>>>>>>>>><BR>
I generally try to stay out of this type of thread; however, I<BR>
really must protest.  The New Testement is one of the<BR>
most studied books ever and is the best authenticated<BR>
document in the history of man.<BR>
<snip><BR>
I'm not saying that you should become a christian;<BR>
however, I am saying that as a historical document,<BR>
there is not a better documented/authenticated one<BR>
extant.<BR>
>>>>>>>><BR>
I think the biggest problem with the historical credibility of the New<BR>
Testament is the fact that most of the people with enough interest in<BR>
it to study it's veracity also had a vested interest in proving that veracity.<BR>
Quite simply, most of the people who pay serious attention to the Bible<BR>
believe that it is accurate (or at least truthful) before they even learn<BR>
to read, much less learn how to study history. It's pretty hard for a<BR>
skeptic to give that kind of apparent bias the benefit of the doubt.<BR>
<BR>
ObTrav: Friction between different cultures/belief systems is always<BR>
a useful plot device. Of course, it usually presents the players with a <BR>
situation that must be escaped, as it can't be resolved. Unless there's <BR>
something godlike about the PC's, they're generally not going to solve in<BR>
a week what a planetful of intelligent (though biased) people haven't been <BR>
able to solve in centuries.<BR>
<BR>
Walt Smith<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 14:36:47 -0600<BR>
From: "Robert Eaglestone" <eaglesto@nortelnetworks.com><BR>
Subject: Traveller Adventure: The Acadian<BR>
<BR>
Traveller Adventure Notes<BR>
"The Acadian"<BR>
<BR>
I would appreciate suggestions!  Post them to the TML or<BR>
email me at eaglesto@nortelnetworks.com<BR>
<BR>
This adventure assumes the PCs have a small starship (100 to<BR>
400 dtons), and a more or less normal crew.  I am also assuming<BR>
they are wandering around District 268, Glisten, Trin's Veil or<BR>
some other place with useful backwaters.  Our group has used<BR>
their characters in the Chamax Plague and Horde.  I guess these<BR>
characters are the Hard Luck PCs.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Scene 1. The Set-Up<BR>
<BR>
[This scene is stolen material from Jens Rydholm... it looks good enough<BR>
to use!]<BR>
<BR>
The PCs are hired by a megacorporation (SuSAG?) to take some<BR>
"medical supplies in sealed containers" to a research station somewhere<BR>
Far Away (TM).  They get paid well, but are ordered to keep the fact<BR>
that they are working for the company secret.<BR>
<BR>
When the ship gets to the destination, they find out that the storage<BR>
limitations at the base requires the containers to be split inside the cargo<BR>
hold, and the smaller cases inside to be unloaded separately.<BR>
<BR>
Inside the containers are several boxes about 2.5x1.0x0.5 meters. They<BR>
have some electronics attached to them, and look suspiciously like low<BR>
berths.<BR>
<BR>
As the last cases are being transported out of the hangar using an old<BR>
four-wheeler of some kind, the PCs recieve their payment from an officer.<BR>
Suddenly, one of the cases crashes to the ground. The plastic breaks, and a<BR>
something shows through. A human hand. The officer rushes the PCs into<BR>
their ship, adds about 25% or so to their payment, gives them a warning<BR>
look, and leaves. They are more or less ordered to leave the station as<BR>
soon as possible.<BR>
<BR>
After this, a number of things could happen. If the PCs go to some kind<BR>
of bigger media, they won't be believed. If they go to smaller, more<BR>
honest media, or perhaps seek rumors in bars or somesuch, they will hear<BR>
rumors of horrible experiments...<BR>
<BR>
In any case, no matter if they talk about the affair or not, the officer<BR>
that paid the PCs will regret (after orders/threats from his superiors)<BR>
that he let them go. Agents of the corporation will begin to look for<BR>
the PCs. Depending on how public they have made themselves, they will be<BR>
more or less easy to find...<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Scene 2.  Shock Value<BR>
<BR>
The PCs arrive in yet another backwater system, to hear a GK<BR>
broadcasting from the outsystem.  They of course load their weapons<BR>
and sneak into the outsystem, where they find a Corsair drifting amidst<BR>
the wreckage of another, comparably-sized vessel.  The ship does not<BR>
respond to hailing.  Analysis of the Corsair reveals it has functioning<BR>
life support, though it appears to have only low levels of power.  Unlikely<BR>
as it seems, the ships appear to have collided, and the corsair somehow<BR>
survived, while the other appears to have been ripped to shreds.<BR>
<BR>
Analysis of the wreckage indicates that the other ship was a 400<BR>
dton unstreamlined vessel.  Residual power signatures indicate it<BR>
had a standard drive/power system.<BR>
<BR>
Boarding the corsair, the crew are randomly attacked by disgusting<BR>
parasitical? creatures lurking on board... which also, by the way, are<BR>
casually eating the corpses of the corsair's former crew.<BR>
<BR>
The crew were wearing Imperial government uniform -- plain navy<BR>
blue with brass and a starburst.  No ID, no name tags... and no<BR>
ship's log.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Scene 3.  The Acadian<BR>
<BR>
The PC's ship arrives in yet another backwater system.  Doing a<BR>
routine scan, they detect two other ships: one is a lab ship, hanging<BR>
out just on the edge of detectability, and the other is a trader, in the<BR>
inner system.  As is common out here, there is no data on either ship.<BR>
The crew notices that the trader is underpowered, and its transponder<BR>
is off, it is not accelerating, and its vector is off the plane of the system;<BR>
in fact, it appears to be adrift, and all attempts at communication will<BR>
result in dead space.<BR>
<BR>
It's not necessary for the players to investigate, but it's most of the<BR>
work I've done so far... the ship is the far trader Acadian.  Its<BR>
power plant is in sleep mode.  It has one laser and one sandcaster.<BR>
Its hull is in fine condition -- no signs of battle scars recent or old.<BR>
<BR>
The ship is of a classic Vilani design -- the casual observer can't<BR>
really tell, but captains generally can -- and boarding the ship will<BR>
confirm the ship's construction.  Her registry is of the Aakkaad<BR>
Shipyards of Vland.  Vilani traders are known to be annoyingly<BR>
low-automation ships, with coded jump tapes, manual power plant<BR>
controls (i.e. control rods, flow valves, and mechanical pressure<BR>
gauges), an analog cockpit, and mechanical air compressors,<BR>
filtration systems, etc.  That said, it is noted that all these pieces<BR>
work beutifully well, giving a cool, smooth, metallic feel to controls<BR>
that would otherwise be digital-in-plastic with solid-state blinking<BR>
lights (Das machine control is nicht fer geverken by das dumkopfen!)<BR>
<BR>
One divergence from the classic Vilani design is in the sensors --<BR>
they are excellent, better than most traders would bother with.<BR>
Of course, in these systems, having good sensors is understandable.<BR>
<BR>
The PCs have two opportunities: they have salvage rights, which<BR>
entitles them to posession of the ship.  The ship is probably worth<BR>
MCr10... unless they take it to Vland, in which case it's worth maybe<BR>
MCr20.  However, a little digging will unearth the identities of the<BR>
former crew of the Acadia -- they look normal enough -- and the<BR>
interesting fact that there was a MCr50 policy taken out on the crew,<BR>
originated from a bank on a world a few parsecs away.  However, no<BR>
more data is forthcoming.  Perhaps it would be interesting to see what<BR>
the bank knows about this.<BR>
<BR>
One of the crew opens the 'fridge, only to find that all the perishables<BR>
- -- stocked only a few days ago -- have gone badly rotten.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Scene 4.  Those Wacky Droyne<BR>
<BR>
The next system has a few obvious ships: a system defense boat<BR>
or two, a trader or two, and another lab ship, which seems to hang<BR>
right on the edge of detection range.<BR>
<BR>
One trader is a Droyne ship.  The Droyne are very friendly, and<BR>
a bit silly.  They have an annoying habit of buzzing the PCs ship.<BR>
At any type of contact they become obsequious to the extreme,<BR>
bringing gifts and interesting food on board if allowed, and inviting<BR>
PCs to their ship to dine with them, play video games, whatever.<BR>
Most are young, but even the older members of the crew seem a<BR>
little daft.  From the innumerable slide shows, party games, and<BR>
magic tricks, the PCs may conclude that the Droyne brain isn't<BR>
geared for focused thought.  A number of ship systems aboard<BR>
the Droyne trader are in disrepair and show signs of obvious<BR>
neglect.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Scene 5.  The Bank<BR>
<BR>
The next system is empty, except for a lab ship in the inner system,<BR>
heading outsystem at a constant 1G in a straight line.  Should the<BR>
PCs trader take a close look at lab ship, they will see Droyne markings<BR>
plainly on the hull, yet the ship maintains communications silence.<BR>
<BR>
If the PCs manage to make contact with it, for some reason (faking<BR>
an emergency and forcing interstellar assistance laws?), they will find<BR>
the ship crewed with humans, not Droyne, who will render as little<BR>
assistance as possible to the trader before scurrying off on their way.<BR>
<BR>
When the PCs reach the bank which issued/holds the insurance policy,<BR>
they will find out that the policy has already been cashed in, by a<BR>
megacorporation... say, SuSAG.<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Scene X.  Now We're A Concerned Party<BR>
<BR>
Imagine their surprise and concern when the crew turns out to have<BR>
a policy placed on them by SuSAG!<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Questions for you.<BR>
<BR>
1) How and when do they find the policy taken out on their ship?<BR>
2) Where to go from here?  What new enigma should be thrown<BR>
on them?  It's been pretty innocuous up to this point...<BR>
3) How can I massage these scenes to blend better?  Or do they<BR>
work together fine?<BR>
4) Should I give them a framework to work within?  For example,<BR>
should they be working for a megacorporation delivering mail between<BR>
these backwater systems and a regional center of commerce?<BR>
5) Should Scenes 1 and 2 be switched in order?  And should Scene 1<BR>
be merged with, say, scene 3 or 4?<BR>
<BR>
<BR>
Answers from me.<BR>
<BR>
A) No, I don't quite know where it's going.<BR>
B) Yes, I'm trying to make this gritty and X-files-like<BR>
<BR>
------------------------------<BR>
<BR>
End of Traveller-digest V1999 #1411<BR>
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